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Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

edithelizabeth2007 by edithelizabeth2007 Speaking(December 2007) (rank 309th)

Well the good news and the bad news is that it is normal for babies to nurse every two hours around the clock during the first 6-8 weeks of life! Another piece of good/bad news is that being tired in no way affects the milk supply- in fact too much sleep without interruption will cause a low milk supply.

This is because the hormone responsible for milk-making, prolactin, only lasts for about three hours after a nursing. If four hours go by without nursing the brain makes another hormone called Prolactin Inhibiting Factor which interferes with milk production. Since prolactin, the milk making hormone, only lasts for 3 hours we can do the math and discover that 8 feedings a day is the bare minimum number of feedings we can expect a baby to get by on during the first six months of life. We can also surmise that if the nursings take place more frequently than every three hours that the milk supply should be even more plentiful and indeed that is true.

Mothers who nurse more than 8 times a day have better milk supplies, and happier babies. Since 8 nursings a day is the bare minimum, and nursing 10-12 times a day is better that means that it must be normal for nursings to take place around the clock and abnormal for babies to sleep thought the night. Don't ask me why pediatricians still push "sleeping through the night" as normal...they need to get an education about how the brain and breast work together to make milk.

So let's think about what happens when a baby is given a bottle of formula even just once a day. Let's say a baby is nursed at 10 pm and then two hours later when the baby is hungry again at midnight the baby is given a bottle of formula. Since breastmilk is more digestable than formula we might expect the baby to sleep longer than the 2 hours she sleeps on breastmilk. Let's say she sleeps between 3-4 hours after a bottle of formula, that means she won't be ready to nurse again until 3am or 4am. Since the last breastfeeding was at 10 pm that means between 5 or 6 hours have elapsed between breastfeeds. The breasts will feel really full at 3 or 4 am from going unemptied so long but the fullness is deceptive. The breasts are really full thanks to the really frequent breastfeeds that took place before 10 pm, but after 1pm the negative hormonal effects of going too long between nursings begin to have their effect which will manifest not at the 3am or 4am feeding but at the subsequent breastfeedings.

If this "relief bottle of formula" is a one time event it probably won't do much harm but if it is done regularly it will mean that the baby will be unsatisfied and unsettled after a lot of breastfeedings during the day because it is not possible to just skip one feeding without affecting the milk supply going forward.

As babies get older they use their calories more efficiently so many mothers find that during 2-4 months of age the baby that had previously nursed every two hours around the clock may start sleeping one long stretch of 4-6 hours at night. As long as the rest of the nursings of the day are about two hours apart most moms find they have enough milk to keep their babies satisified even though they have this one long stretch which is suboptimal from a hormonal point of view. If the baby is unhappy at the breast during the day the mom needs to wake the baby during the long stretch of sleep for a nursing to recover her milk supply.

Other mothers find during the 2-4 month period that their babies do not take a 4-6 hour stretch at night but they do start to go a little longer between all the nursings of the day- going every 2 1/2 to three hours between nursings whereas previously they never went longer than 2 hours between nursings.

 Around six months of age many babies revert back to taking the breast every 2-3 hours at night because the fat content of milk is higher at night and when they are growing rapidly as in the newborn period or learning to sit alone and crawl this extra fat helps myelinate the nerves that make these developmental advancements happen. After these developmental changes have taken place the baby will go back to sleeping longer stretches at night until the next major myelination takes place when babies are learning to walk around a year of age.

So since sleeping through the night is not physiologically normal and babies have a couple of reversions back to frequent night nursings what is a mom to do to feel rested????

Well it helps to think about all the generations of breastfeeding moms that came before the era of bottlefeeding- what did they do to survive on broken sleep? Well for one thing they did not have their babies down the hall. They did not get up out of bed and try to stay awake while nursing a baby in a chair. They slept with their babies and they didn't have to fully wake up and neither did the baby for night nursings. They learned how to nurse in the side lying position and fall right back to sleep while nursing.

If co-sleeping were inherently dangerous for breastfeeding mothers and babies the human race would not have survived. Modern moms can learn how to safely co-sleep too. All it really involves is a firm mattress on the floor (no bed frame) and staying in the bed with your baby (using a crib or bassinet if the baby is sleeping alone) and never leaving the baby in the bed with anyone else. Non-lactating women, dads and other kids don't have the hormones of lactation. The hormones of lactation alter the sleep states of breastfeeding mothers so that they are excellent caregivers even in their sleep. (See the work of sleep researchers James McKenna and Helen Ball)

Another thing nursing moms can do to feel more rested is just change their sleep habits. It is tempting to stay awake after the baby goes to bed for the night or to get up early ahead of the baby the next day to get things done, but this is some of the deepest and longest stretches of sleep a baby will take. When a baby is young it is important for moms to take advantage of these longer deeper stretches of infant sleep to get the rest they need. When the baby is older many moms find that they can choose either to go to bed a little later or get up a little earlier than the baby does and still feel rested, but moms with young babies need to obey the golden rule of new motherhood - "sleep when the baby is asleep."

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tunky
February 27th | tunky
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

I'm not sure I believe that mothers in days of old were all co sleeping. Maybe some were, but I don't believe it was commonplace. I know it is popular with some ppl now, but there is a risk of sudden infant death syndrome with co sleeping, which isn't often discussed



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      KathrynR1402
5.00 (Excellent) | February 27th | KathrynR1402
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing,

You might be interested to know that there are some studies which demonstrate that co-sleeping while breastfeeding actually reduces the risk of SIDS. See this link. Obviously co-sleeping when drinking or on medication which makes you sleepy, or even when not b/f any more (and therefore not as aware of your child - believe me, I sleep like a log when Im not feeding, but when Im feeding Im the opposite and dont move a muscle or miss a cough LOL!) increases the risks, which is why FSIDS and the rest advise against it, but if you look at the breakdown of why babies died in with their parents, I think you will find they are often babies who are not used to being in with mum or dad, or who should never have been in with mum & dad (eg because one is a smoker). There have always been instances of babies being in with mum - my MIL was in with her mum for years because she was a bad sleeper and her dad was a soldier who never returned from WW2. Her mum used to complain about how much she'd saved up for the cot "and you never slept in it once"! I suspect that in 2 up 2 down houses, baby was probably in with mum & dad until the next one came along and they were then put in the bed in the other room with all their siblings.



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      Snooty-Farkleboob
February 27th | Snooty-Farkleboob
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing,

Where were babies sleeping before the advent of cribs and cots?



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JadieLady
3.00 (Average) | December 2007 | JadieLady
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

I dont completely agree with oyu. Yes, your information is very well researched and practical for sure. But not all people fit the textbooks if you know what i mean.

ALthough my first slept all throught hte night from 4 weeks ( and how lovely it was), I gave him his relief feed at midnight. Every night. until i stopped breastfeeding at three months (No matterwhat aussie doctors tell you- implanon is NOT a safe method of contraception for breastfeeding mothers- it suppresses lactation)he was about 6 months and no longer required it. This only effected my breastmilk in a positive manner. Let me explain.

Being a rather big girl ,and having a hungry bubby, those hormones worked hard all night to produce the milk. THe next morning I would awaken engorged like you wouldnt beleive ( actually thought I had mastitis for awhile but was set straight by a nurse) The effect of this was 1- my son couldnt latch on properly due to the size, 2 there when I had expressed enough for him to latch on it was coming out too fast and he would choke and 3, he had trouble finishing off one breast, leaving me with a really painful second breast, and the other still abotu 1/3 full. by the time i finished expressing these it was time for his next feed, ( which he would have out of a bottle ) and then by the time of the next feed i was engorged all over again.

The releif feed at midnight made it so I had the right amount of milk in the morning without it being painful and solved the problems of attachment, choking and expressing. I was able to give him the breast for all his other feeds and have the right supply for these. Sometimes the formula can be what you need to get through life more comfortably. I good start to the day can make all the difference in the world!



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      edithelizabeth2007
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | edithelizabeth2007
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing,

Hi Jadie,

You are right to surmise that the milk-making hormone is higher at night. Prolactin is also a hormone involved in sleep (and digestion) and if a mom is going to skip a nursing in the middle of the night would be the least damaging time to do it from a hormonal point of view.

From the point of view of the baby exclusive breastfeeding is best because the most important way breastfeeding protects against illnesses is that it starves harmful bacteria of iron so they can't grow. The iron in breastmilk is lactoferrin and lactoferrin is sequestered from pathogenic bacteria but given preferentially to the baby.

Formula contains free iron which is easily used by bacteria so even a once a day bottle of formula by a mother with a copious milk supply is a crying shame because it undoes one of the main ways breastfeeding protects a baby..

Another problem with skipping a feeding is that it does lead to engorgement and mastitis, as you describe in your post. If a mom doesn't skip nursings she avoids engorgement and the increased risk of mastitis.

All mothers feel their fullest in the early morning hours even if they didn't skip any night feedings because of the extra prolactin the brain makes at night. A mom who skips feeding transfers 2-3 ounces less breastmilk to her baby for each feeding she misses, whereas the mother who didn't skip any feeding transferred 2-3 ounces more for each additonal nursing and she still feels full in the morning.

Because milk synthesis is most rapid when the breast is emptiest the mom who empties her breast frequently actually produces more milk in a 24 hour period than the mom who goes too long between feedings. The mom who goes too long between feedings may "feel" fuller but this feeling is deceptive and bodes ill for her future milk supply.

In addition to the extra prolactin we have at night  moms also have a lot of extra prolactin during the first 3-4 months of after the birth of a baby.  This extra prolactin is referred to as a "prolactin" safety net."

 What this means is that nature is kind to new mothers and babies and mothers have extra prolactin while they are still learning to breastfeed. This "prolactin safety net" can compensate when mothers are trying to avoid cue-feeding and are nursing on a bottle-feeding schedule, or if they are replacing some nursings with bottlefeedings. 

But at 3-4 postpartum this prolactin safety net disappears and  moms who have deviated too much from cue-feeding and exclusive breastfeeding offer suffer acute lactation failure at this time.

The more often a mother puts her baby to breast in the early weesk and months of lactation the more prolactin receptors she will make in her breast tissue. More proalctin receptors mean a little prolactin can go a long way later in lactation. This is why mothers can continue to make a lot of breastmilk even in the face of declining levels of prolactin if they nursed very frequently in the early weeks and months of lactation.

Implanon is a progesterone only contraceptive. As a lactation consultant I tell moms to avoid all hormonal contraceptives, but progesterone only contraceptives, as long as they aren't inserted soon after the birth, don't change the volume of milk produced, although theoretically they could change the milk compostion.

Because you were entering the time of less background prolactin at the same time you received the Implanon it seemed to you that the Implanon was the sole cause of the breastfeeding problems, but more likely it was the missed feedings. Some mothers actually experience an increase in milk production on progesterone only contraceptives but it wouldn't be enough to compensate for going too long between feedings or regular substitutions of breastfeeding with bottle-feedings in the early months.

I had lots of breastfeeding troubles myself with my first baby. La Leche League helped me tremendously with my second baby. Austrialia also has the wondeful Nursing Mothers Association. With your next baby you they could help you if you had an oversupply of milk...that is they could help you down regulate safely so you didn't get terribly engorged or get mastitis but still nurse frequently enough that you would be able to nurse after the prolactin safety net disappears three to four months postpartum.



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Izzy
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | Izzy
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

Thank you for editing. It has paragraph breaks now and much much easier to read.

This is excellent! You've explained breastfeeding very well in a manner that is easy to understand and not technical.

My son fits in the category of not sleeping through the night, or not even sleeping long stretches. I didn't get long stretches of sleep until he was about 11 months old. As a newborn he was feeding every 1 1/2 - 2 hours so it was very hard on me. I mentioned this to the pediatrician once and he suggested to supplement with formula at night. I tried it once (with my hubby giving the formula so I could sleep)  and because my breasts felt very full and uncomfortable, I had to get up and pump. What was the use if I had to get up anyway? So I threw away that idea, as it took longer to pump then it was to just nurse.

With my now 6 month old twins, I had to supplement because they needed the high calorie formula in order to gain weight (they were preemies). But even though I gave them formula, I nursed first, and then the formula. So that meant that even if they slept 4 hours, at least it was only 4 hours from the last breastfeeding, instead of maybe 6-8 hours had I not breastfeed first before giving the formula.  It made night feeding very very long this way though.  Thankfully, by 2-3 months, I was able to eliminate the formula altogether.

As far as the co-sleeping, it's the only way to go for the round the clock feeding. That way mom can fall asleep while nursing. 



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      edithelizabeth2007
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | edithelizabeth2007
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing,

Great Izzy!

Nursing premie twins is such an accomplishement! And returning to exclusive breastfeeding!

If your next pregancy is twins or a premie I'll send you some evidenced based breastfeeding medicine about premies and human milk fortifier. It's very interesting stuff that most neonatalogists have not yet incorporated into their practice. Nancy Wright MD has written a very interesting self-study module on the subject.

Formula feeding premies is very controversial because of the osmolarity of premie formulas and human milk fortifiers. Human milk can be lacto-engineered (the fat fraction of human milk can be used to create a high calorie human milk...hey who needs high calorie formula!) but most NICUs just don't want to be bothered because they don't know the data yet.

Doctors are usually trying to mimic intrauterine growth rates with premie formulas but just because premie formula can put weight faster on a baby than unengineered human milk it does not mean the health outcomes of these artificially fed babies are better. Weight gain is only one facet of health, and premies who are fed straight mothers milk or engineered human milk have even greater immunological protection and get out of the hospital earlier than babies who are fed premie formula or mothers milk with fortification even if the artifically fed baby gains weight more rapidly.

Even though doctors say when the baby weighs X number of pounds he can go home, the truth is even if the baby weights X number of pounds if he is fightening an infection he will not get to go home. Also doctors who are up on the science now realize that health and the ability to breastfeed are more important than numbers on a scale so if a baby is healthy and able to transfer milk well at the breast doctors are now sending the babies home at lower weights to get them out of the dangerous infection ridden environment of the hospital.

Getting out of the hospital when a baby can breathe well is so helpful that some docotrs teach mothers how to gavage feed the baby her milk until the baby is able to breastfeed. The mother gavages feed the baby mother's milk at home until the baby is able to breastfeed and the baby goes straight from gavage to the breast without ever getting a bottle which is a tremendous help for avoiding breastfeeding troubles.

One thing that helped you even when the babies were getting formula is that there were two of them. Even though they slept longer than they would have on just breastmilk alone when they did wake up there were two of them nursing.... so you were getting twice the nipple stimulation which means a lot of extra prolactin that moms of singletons don't get. If you had had only one baby the longer stretches between nursings because of the formula supplement might have been more harmful to your milk supply.

 Besides nursing two babies one after the other, nursing twins at the same time can really help build a milk supply. When moms of twins nurse their babies at the same time they  get more than twice the prolactin response as when they just nurse one at a time which means nursing simultaneously when mothers of twins can manage it (which can be hard if not impossible when they are newborns) is better for milk production than nursing one at a time.

This physiological insight into mothers of twins is why double pumping is now advised to pump dependent mothers. It is hard to maintain a milk supply with pumping but double pumping gives an extra prolactin boost which can help compensate for the fact that the mother is having to pump instead of breastfeed the baby directly.

Anyway the I know all the incredible obstacles mothers of multiples and especially premie multiples face and you can be so proud of yourself that you conquered every hurdle in your path! You are an inspiration!



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           Izzy
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | Izzy
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing,

So glad you talked about breastfeeding twins at the same time. I have always done it, because I read that it's better this way so that I don't feel like I'm literally feeding round the clock. I'm glad it also made sure my milk supply didn't go down! 

The girls are now going about 4 hours between feedings, though I usually don't go that long since they sleep long at night, I just fill them up during the day (usually every 3 hours). I've been thinking lately that I may just nurse them one at a time now. What do you think? I will eventually just have to feed them one at a time because they are getting way too long for my twin breastfeeding pillow. Sometimes there is no amount of pillow manipulation that can get them to stop pushing off with their feet and taking the breast with them (ouch!).

The NICU actually didn't have  a set weight for my girls before they could be released. The only criteria on weight is that they have to be gaining. So on the day they turned 35 weeks when they started gaining weight, we were able to take them home (only 10 days in the NICU!).



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edithelizabeth2007
December 2007 | edithelizabeth2007
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

Okay I figured out my problem...I was using Safari...so I used a different browser and put in the paragraphs. Sorry again to all of you who read it without paragraphs...I couldn't read it that way...I was going blind trying to...



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edithelizabeth2007
December 2007 | edithelizabeth2007
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping
Sorry ladies about the lack of paragraphs...for some reason the breaks between paragraphs don't appear but they are there when I pull the article up to edit it... if anyone can tell e how to correct this problem I will be happy to do it...it is impossible to read the way it is and I am surprised any of you managed to dot it...but thanks for the positive feedback


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KathrynR1402
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | KathrynR1402
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

As with the others, I struggled to read what is a REALLY fascinating article because of lack of paragraphs. It would really benefit the Minti community if you could edit this.

Peoples expectations are so out of synch with nature arent they? Ive given up telling people how often DD2 wakes except when she's ill as I dont want advice given with the sympathy as twice a night with a co-sleeping baby is FINE in my book. It leaves me well rested. Now, 8x when she was ill recently, and I do need the sympathy ladled on LOL!



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winja
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | winja
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping
great advice i breastfeed and co sleep after the first nightfeed each night my bub has slept at 6 hour stretches since birth and is 2 weeks old and sometimes i wake up feeling that FULL feeling and wish eh woudl wake up lol


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MumKim
December 2007 | MumKim
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping
Really great advice but it is very hard to read without paragraphs.


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angieh
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | angieh
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping
Great advice, and I have to agree with the others - it was rather difficult to follow as the advice is all in one paragraph.

Would it be possible for you to edit this article and put paragraphs in for easier reading?


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cassaustin
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | cassaustin
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

Great advice, but i'm with Izzy and Phoenix, it was really difficult to read and follow. I kept on loosing where i was up to...

I did co sleep with my baby til he was about 2 1/2 months old. At that stage he started sleeping better when he was on his own than he did beside me. I think smelling me he kept on waking up. But i still do spend a couple of hours a day with him in bed with me, usually the first morning feed for the bonding, convenience and so we can get a little bit more sleep.  

I have never offered him formula, although i have considered it so that i can get some more sleep!!



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PHOENIX
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | PHOENIX
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping
great article -I agree with Izzy but that it needs some paragraph breaks as it's a bit hard to read through.
Modern mums really have no realistic expectations of what newborns are like. We aren't taught that frequent waking is normal instead we are frequently asked if we have a  'good baby'. Sleep when baby sleeps is the best piece of advice new mums can get-housework isn't important and it wills till be there when you wake up.
I never actively co-slept but that is because my partner smokes and also has been on heavy pain medication and I didn't think it was safe. However if I had ever decided to have another child I would have bought one of those side cots and co-slept. The few times that I have (like when he was working away) have been the most rested for all of us.


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Izzy
5.00 (Excellent) | December 2007 | Izzy
Re: Breastfeeding, night nursing, "relief bottles" and co-sleeping

Hi there. I have only read the first half and it's great so far...however, I will have to take a break as I keep losing my place because there are no paragraph breaks.  So if you find the time, it would be great as it is easier on the eyes.

Anyway, I haven't voted yet as I have not finished reading, as I said. Will get back to it later.



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