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MummaBear
MummaBear | February 2007

Carseats

How do I tell friends and family in a tactful manner that my daughter will not be travelling in their car unless they have a carseat bolt installed and agree to have the carseat put in.  They don't want to put a bolt in even though I said I'd buy it and they don't want the carseat in their car because it might damage their seat. They think I should buy a foam booster and said to get the ones with the part on the side that guides the seatbelt.  I will not have my child in a booster seat, she will stay in her safety seat until she is around 7 or 8, depending on her height at the time, and will stay in a harness until I decide otherwise.  You can now buy harnesses to fit children up to 12.  I'm called over-protective and pedantic (sp?) but it's the way I am.  I have been to the funeral of a small child who was not securely strapped into the car.  I want to get the point across that I would rather drive her myself than have her in a foam booster seat without a harness, but I don't want to cause negative feelings.  My mother has a carseat in her car and my brother has had a bolt put into his car so her carseat can go in there, but other people won't but want to take her places and think i'm being controlling and unreasonable. I have a way of saying things in an abrupt manner and end up not talking to people for ages after that so I just need to know a tactful yet forceful way.  Thanks!

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kitten
February 2007 | kitten
Carseats

In the Uk they have made it law that any child under 12 or 4ft 9 must have a booster seat however the police here do not have the resources to implement this law and check that the children are in the right size seat etc. I suppose although they made the law it is still down to the parents to ensure that the right level of safetly is applied whoever and whereever they are travelling. My car seat does not have a bolt but can be taken in and out of the car and is secured by the adult seat belt and various clips therefore easily transferable from car to car. It is a reclining seat which is forward or rearward facing as was from birth to 4 years. This is great when i have to give to other family members to drive or even switching to my fiances car. This seat meets european standards and i am not sure whether they would meet the austrialian standards.



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      emmysmum
2.82 (Average) | February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
that is just ridiculous if you ask me! ok, so you might think i am a bad mum....go ahead i don't care....because you are not here to see how much of a good mum i am. But 12 is just ridiculous and taking things toooooooooo far. I will not be allowing my daughter to ride in a car unless i am there and unless she is in a safety seat that can be bolted to the car until the age of 4, then she will be in a booster seat up until the age of 6! I love my daughter and would never put her life at risk!


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           PHOENIX
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | PHOENIX
Carseats

I suppose people will always see things differently. I will put my child into a car seat with 5 point harness until they can no longer fit (recomendations is until their shoulders cannot fit). I am not overprotective anymore then not allowing my child to play on the road or in a creek.  My kids are small (bottom 3% of chart) so the chances are they will fit into a car seat much longer then most kids.

Emmysmum I don't doubt you are a good mum but I know from my experience I would rather put in the extra precaution to possibly save my childs life. My DP survived his car accident only because of his airbag. The other car was virtually the same type of car but no airbag and the driver died (his fault and serves him right but thats not the point). Cars are fairly safe but a car with an airbag is safer, a car with 5 airbags even safer again. Yes a booster is safer then no booster but a safety seat is even safer again.

 



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      MummaBear
February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
All carseats can be transfered from one car to another so long as the car has a bolt to clip it onto. It is bolted in at the back and the adult seatbelt goes around it. just gives that double line of defence in an accident.  I wouldn't have it any other way.


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angelmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | angelmum
Carseats
My daughter is in a foam booster but she has a harness that is bolted in, she is the same age as your daughter there is no way I would allow her to travel in a car without it, my hubby used to work in the baby industry and he said they can not travel without a harness in a booster seat unless they are 18kg or over, so thats the law, if they can't abide by that then I would not let her travel with them.  You would think your daughters safety would be more important then the cost of a bolt added to the car!!


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      emmysmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
That is dead right! 4yrs or 18kg, whatever comes first! But do you know what gets on my nerves? When people who work for daycare or a midwifes think they know everything about children and the law! This isn't all of them though, there are a few of them out there though!


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      MummaBear
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
Unfortunately, angelmum, it's not the law. A child under 12 months must be in a baby seat of Australian standards. Anything over 12 months is simply 'safety recommendations' and not the law. But regardless of that, I don't think they should travel without a 5-point safety harness until they are much older.  I will follow the RACQ safety guidelines and keep my child safe and put someone out a bit rather than have a child who is not safe in a car.  Too many children are killed on the roads, and it's not just from the driver of that car being slack behind the wheel, you can't trust that everyone around you will drive safely. People run red lights. People speed.  So saying they are a 'safe driver' is nothing to me.


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           angelmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | angelmum
Carseats
Its not law?? well I find that rediculous, I really don't see the big deal in it, these recommendations come from safety experts, I would rather follow their guideines than any one elses opinion, my kids will be in a safety harness and seat until they are way to big to fit them, I don't care if they are 4 6 or 12, I would rather my child to be alive then dead


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PHOENIX
February 2007 | PHOENIX
Carseats

Mummabear there is no way you are being overprotective. I still have my kids in the reversable car seats but intend to buy the safety seats when they get older as they will take them to a much higher age and weight. (I have friends who have their kids in adult seatbelts from 12 mths just because the law allows- not right at all) The problem with booster seats is not the seat themselves but the fact that the seatbelt is all that is holding your child in. If that seatbelts fails well use your imagination. The safety seats have a bolt and 5 point harness so that kids have double protection against crash injuries. My kids are small so if they are still in those seats at 10-12 then so be it. I nearly lost my partner to some iditot drunk driver the only thing that saved him was the airbag.

I'm not sure where it is mummabear but somewhere on one of those u-tube type sites is actually a short docco from a mother who lost her son becasue he was in a booster. the childs sister was int he exact same seat but her seatbelt held the sons didn't and he was thrown from the car. Perhaps if you could find that and show it to these people it might help. Apart from that calmly but very strongly tell them why you are doing this and lets face it if you were an overprotective parent you wouldn't allow your child out full stop.  Maybe you could also tell them that if they were to take your child with just a booster seat and your child was hurt in a crash  then they wouldn't want to survive the crash IYKWIM.

bring on the law changes the sooner the better!!!!!



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      MummaBear
February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
Yes my cousin has sent me the link to that. Very scary stuff.  That little boy gone because his seatbelt didn't hold him and parents think it's safe if the law allows boosters to be used.


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lucky321
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | lucky321
Carseats

i didn't let my kids in others poeple car with out a car seat , I also had a spare one  on hand with the bolt realy to go  if needed it .Most cars theses days  have place to put the bolt in with causing damage

                    Most grandparents don't have them anyway  so it was better  have a sceond one. The front seat the kids aren't allow in the front  i think its dangers anyway .



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zacsmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | zacsmum
Carseats
I totally agree with you. To me the ability to save my child's life is pricless. Statisticly getting in a car is the biggest risk we will ever take. Stick to your guns. As far as I'm concerned a carseat goes without saying until you can't find one to fit them in and I'm very suprised with the amount of road deaths that other people don't think the same!


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      emmysmum
February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
I lost my mum in a car accident about 10 yrs ago.... And although of course she wasnt a child, she was only young.
HOWEVER, i was a child, and i was also in that car. And although i am still alive, i was very seriously injured. I do not believe that any form of safety seat could have changed my injuries, in fact i think the safety seat would make them worse! It is only my opinion, from my experience in a car accident! I have also received injury from being in a car accident in a safety seat. My skull had not closed properly and was still a little soft....so when the accident occurred, my head flung forward and i bumped my head, I got a lump and it never disappeared, so now i have a permanent bump on my forehead!
A head injury is much worse than a broken leg and a few bits of glass here and there and a lacerated liver!


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           zacsmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | zacsmum
Carseats
My friend's daughter was 7yrs old on the seat with seat bealt. Her seatbelt injuries included a ruptured bowel and she had to have a hysterectomy plus other things. That was from being to small in a seatbelt. Her sister a couple of years older was fine.


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                emmysmum
2.00 (Poor) | February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
sorry for your friends daughter. It's not nice having such horrible injuries, and i am not being insensitive by saying this, but i think i would rather have all of that then a nasty blow to the head that could also cause death.....fatal.....straight away death.
I had to have a laparoscopy, i was only 9..... i had 6 ops in 7 weeks! It wasn't nice....plus i am also allergic to morphine so my pain rate was pretty high....
I hope your friends daughter is ok now, or gets well soon!


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                     zacsmum
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | zacsmum
Carseats

Sorry you went through that but my point was her injuries could of been avoided if she had been in a proper seat!!



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                     MummaBear
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
The seat, the harness and everything has to be adjusted to fit the child. If it isn't adjusted correctly then it can do more than good.  I knew of a child who was on a booster seat with a lap belt only and was cut in half internally in an accident. It was one of those ones without a back on it.  The head can't go above the top of the seat, but safety seats are made bigger to fit children to around the age of 8, depending on size. My daughter is on the lower end of the scale where weight is concerned but is tall for her age, but the harness can be bought for them without them being in a seat for children and even up to adult size and can be used once they've outgrown any seat.


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gc
2.50 (Average) | February 2007 | gc
Carseats
I agree with Emmysmum.

Once a child's eyes are level with the top of their baby carseat, it is time to go into a booster. The risks of a child breaking their neck in an accident from an unsupported head (due to being too big for the seat) increase.

How old is your daughter?


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      gc
February 2007 | gc
Carseats
Oh and the same eye level rule applies to booster seats. Then it is safer to be on the car seat itself.

This information comes from my paranoia and a friend of mine who is an ambulance officer.


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      MummaBear
February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
My daughter is 3, and her seat is not a reversible baby seat, it is a safety seat that is designed for children up to age 8. It can be used with a harness or with a seatbelt, the seat itself is bolted into the car. She no longer rides in the baby seat that goes up to age 4.


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           gc
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | gc
Carseats
Okay well I would agree with you on the bolt thing, especially at age 3. Has the seat damaged your car at all? If not, then show these friends. Otherwise perhaps offer to buy a carseat cover for their back seat to protect their possession. Funny how material objects seem to be worth more than a child's life...



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                MummaBear
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
I have one of those things that covers the carseat, and it has pockets in it too so it doesn't dig into the seats in my car. I offer these to people wanting to take her but they think it's too much hassle and I'm just stopping them from seeing her.  Huh? I said they could take the seat, the carseat cover (for their carseats) and I would buy the bolt! Or drive her and drop her off to them and pick her up later, I'd rather spend money on petrol than have her unsafe in their car.


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emmysmum
3.33 (Average) | February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
if your daughter is a toddler, then goddamn, you have every right to refuse them to take her and you also have the right to be a protective mum. However, i do think that making a child stay in a harnessed seat until the age of 7-8 up to 12 is far too protective.
I feel for the family who lost their dear child but, just because it happened to their child it doesn't mean it will happen to yours!
if your daughter is 4+ then i assure you, a booster is safe enough! once the child is 6+ no booster is required. You REALLY need to think of other cons surrounding the booster after the age of 6! Your child will suffer from tormenting, and if you do happen to have an accident and the seat is a harnessed one....it will be much harder to free the child! These are things you need to think of!
i too am rather pedantic, but have learnt to control it, as i know that i cannot wrap my daughter in cotton wool forever!
I probably haven't helped you alot, but good luck!


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      MummaBear
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
Laws are hopefully being changed very soon.  The safety recommendations which are to become law state that a child remains in a harnessed, bolted in car seat until the age of 4 then in a booster seat, still bolted in and with a harness, until the age of 8.  Children will no longer be allowed in the front seat until they are 12, but I know it's being pushed the safety recommendations to become law and hopefully sooner rather than later. I am very strict when it comes to car safety and nutrition.  I don't hold her back in any way though, she is excelling in everything she does. She swam 25 metres today in water that was way over her head.  I know that legally a 12 month old baby can sit in an adult seat in the rear of the car but that's just stupid and that's why laws are being pushed through to be in line with safety recommendations.  The seat she is in is a safety seat, not a baby seat, and will do her til she is up to 8, but that goes on size too.  She is safe in the car and she is very healthy, and I just need to know a way of telling my family and friends that this is how we do things without coming across as being nasty. I wasn't after criticism for keeping my child safe in the car.  My child is far from wrapped in cotton wool, she is exposed to far more than other children of her age.  I know that her safety seat just that, a safety seat, and I can undo the clip on the harness easier than if i had to fish around for a seatbelt clip that has gone to the back of the car or is under the booster seat.  I do not believe that foam boosters are safe on their own, they need a bolted in harness, and I refuse ever to allow her in those soft foam ones, the hard foam ones are alright but she hasn't been in one.  She won't suffer tormenting at school if it's made mandatory and parents start getting fines for not securely restraining their children in the car. her friends will be in harnesses too.


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           emmysmum
1.00 (Very Poor) | February 2007 | emmysmum
Carseats
I see what you mean by abrupt....settle yourself down, i wasn't attacking you!
I am aware of the laws. I am currently taking a legal course actually, so i am right in to law! You went way over the top, you really need to learn some control with your abruptness! I never did imply in any way that you are a bad mother or that your daughter was unhealthy or stupid!
I can however see things from both sides, as you need to learn to do aswell! I was very abrupt like you, and i have learnt to control it, because with abrupt speech and actions, it does nothing but push people away, cause conflict between family and destroy family!
This is a very important issue within society, and you are likely to get mixed responses!
You need to be prepared for the mixed responses and accept them, as you asked the question!
And just for the record, i too am very strict when it comes to car safety, nutrinional and health needs and educational needs!
I wasn't criticising your parenting, i was just answering the question MY WAY!
The best way to tell people who won't listen about safety is to show them pictures of what could happen.....DONT BE ABRUPT.... BE CIVIL!


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                MummaBear
5.00 (Excellent) | February 2007 | MummaBear
Carseats
Sorry but I did take offense to the comment about being too overprotective and about how no booster is required after age 6 when RACQ recommendations are aged 8. I don't believe she will be criticised if enough parents do it and there are plenty who do it that I socialise with and that's who she will be going to school with.  I just wasn't asking advice on when to take her out to change her social status at school, but rather how do I keep her safe now and let others know in a tactful way that they cannot take her in their car without it being to my standards, which are the RACQ safety standards. I won't drop my standards.  I didn't mean to come across as abrupt but I'm not wrapping her up in cotton wool or setting her up for criticism. She will not take criticism anyway.  I know she's good like that, she isn't a bully but she won't get pushed around either.


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